long ago ideas

“When we are tired, we are attacked by ideas we conquered long ago." - Friedrich Nietzsche. Long ago, Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery conquered false claims that the Book of Mormon was fiction or that it came through a stone in a hat. But these old claims have resurfaced in recent years. To conquer them again, we have to return to what Joseph and Oliver taught.

Friday, April 11, 2025

The end of M2C

Hill Cumorah, NY
Readers here know that I'm fine with people believing whatever they want, including M2C (the Mesoamerican/two-Cumorahs theory). It's completely fine with me for anyone to believe M2C. 

And I hope no one gets into arguments or contention about the setting of the Book of Mormon. 

See http://nomorecontention.com/

Instead, on this blog we pursue (i) clarity, (ii) charity and (iii) understanding. We encourage people to make informed decisions for themselves.

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In reverse order, on this blog we seek to understand others and we assume they all act in good faith.

Clarity is usually the hard part. Instead of seeking clarity and separating facts from assumptions, inferences and theories (the FAITH model), people usually seek to confirm their biases, which means they (i) ignore/reject evidence that contradicts their biases and (ii) welcome/fantasize about evidence that confirms their biases.

Starting with clarity, the entire M2C edifice was built upon three layers of a sandy foundation: 

(i) The 1842 Times and Seasons articles attributed (wrongly) to Joseph Smith;

(ii) the conviction that all the prophets who taught Cumorah was in New York were wrong; and

(iii) deference to scholars who promoted M2C with dubious "correspondences" to Mayan culture, censorship and even ridicule of the teachings of the prophets, and numerous fallacies of fact and logic.

At this point, it's just a matter of time before M2C itself disappears. 

Latter-day Saints everywhere are becoming better educated about Church history, the teachings of the prophets, and the relevant extrinsic evidence, all of which combine to corroborate the teachings of the prophets about the origin and setting of the Book of Mormon.

Apart from legal technicalities, the following organizations that promoted M2C have vanished:

BMAF (Book of Mormon Archaeological Foundation)

FARMS (Foundation for Ancient Research and Mormon Studies)

Book of Mormon Central

NOTE: One legacy holdout is the Interpreter Foundation, but they mostly talk among themselves (citation cartel) and few outside their organization take them seriously, anyway, because it's obvious to everyone outside their bubble that they are merely confirming their biases. Most Latter-day Saints reject the Interpreters' biases once they realize that the Interpreters forthrightly reject and repudiate the teachings of the prophets on the origin and setting of the Book of Mormon.  

So what is left of M2C?

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We won't take the time here to review all the evidence. There are innumerable podcasts, blogs, books, articles, and websites that cover all of that. For example, see https://www.mobom.org/church-history-issues

The bottom line for M2C is this table:

New York Cumorah

M2C (Cumorah in Mexico)

Moroni called the hill Cumorah during his first visit to Joseph Smith

Joseph Smith, Lucy Mack Smith, and Oliver Cowdery were all wrong

Joseph referred to the hill as Cumorah even before he translated the plates

Lucy Mack Smith was wrong

The messenger took the abridged plates from Harmony to Cumorah

David Whitmer was wrong

Joseph and Oliver visited the repository in Cumorah multiple times

Oliver Cowdery, David Whitmer, Brigham Young, Wilford Woodruff, Heber C. Kimball were all wrong

Joseph’s contemporaries and successors in Church leadership, including members of the First Presidency speaking in General Conference, reaffirmed that Cumorah is in New York

They were all wrong because a few RLDS and LDS scholars figured out that the “real” Cumorah must be in Mexico to make their maps of the Book of Mormon fit

To clarify, faithful Latter-day Saints are free to believe M2C. There is no test for faithfulness that requires them to believe the teachings of the prophets about Cumorah, nor do they need to believe the authentic Church history accounts.

But every faithful Latter-day Saint should at least make an informed decision about Cumorah. And M2C survives mainly by keeping Latter-day Saints ignorant of what the prophets have taught and the evidence that corroborates their teachings.

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Recently I had a conversation with yet another M2Cer who claimed he "knows" the Book of Mormon took place in Mesoamerica. I asked how he knew. He said "I was convinced by a book by [author's name withheld.]"

Not surprisingly, he hadn't read any books from another point of view. And he had no idea what the prophets taught about Cumorah.

This is a fine example of the "documentary effect," which occurs when someone watches a documentary and believes what was presented.

Few documentaries show more than one side of an issue, and even when they do so, they slant the presentation to persuade viewers to adopt the views of the documentary filmmakers. Documentaries are designed to make people think they are educated about a topic. But viewers are often unaware that the documentaries they watch usually employ sophisticated persuasion tactics.

This is not to say that all M2Cers are uninformed and/or misinformed--but most of them are. And most of them are satisfied with that, like the M2C friend I just mentioned.

Which is fine with me. We can't expect everyone, or even most people, to seek to make informed decisions.

Nevertheless, Latter-day Saints are encouraged to make informed decisions. 

One reason why the organizations listed above no longer exist is that they were the antithesis of openness, transparency, and even normal academic discourse. They obsessed with M2C to the point where they would not tolerate, let alone host, honest and civil dialog and comparisons between M2C and alternatives. 

I forgot to mention another legacy holdout: FAIRLDS. They have some good information, but regarding the origin and setting of the Book of Mormon, that site is a collection of anonymous articles and excerpts that are transparent bias confirmation. They make no effort to present multiple perspectives and thus lack credibility.

As it became apparent that these M2C-promoting organizations were not only uninterested in educating the Saints, but actively opposed people making informed decisions, the organizations naturally vanished.

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Based on the innumerable anecdotes such as the one above, many Latter-day Saints are going through the process I went through.

Decades ago I, too, believed the M2C theory. I thought John Sorenson's theories were scholarly and persuasive. Everyone I knew in the Church had adopted the "limited geography" model set in Mesoamerica, with Cumorah in southern Mexico. 

But, like most Latter-day Saints, I was busy and simply deferred to Sorenson and the other "Book of Mormon scholars." 

When I began seriously investigating M2C a few years ago, it became apparent that M2C survives mainly on ignorance; i.e., people believed M2C because 

(i) they didn't know what the prophets have taught and 

(ii) they didn't know about alternative interpretations that corroborated the teachings of the prophets. 

Once I educated myself, it became obvious that the prophets were correct all along and that the M2C scholars were promoting their own ideas.

It wasn't easy for me to change my mind, but apparently it was much easier for me than it is for the long-time, committed M2Cers.

For that reason, we all need to be patient and pursue clarity, charity and understanding.

Eventually most, if not all, Latter-day Saints will accept the teachings of the prophets and we'll have even greater unity and understanding of the Book of Mormon.



Monday, April 7, 2025

Mission Accomplished


This may be the penultimate post on this blog.

When I started blogging years ago, I was making notes to myself that I could access everywhere. People started asking me questions, and it was easier to direct them to the blog than to answer everyone individually. Then I started different blogs for different topics.

Recently I reviewed the Google data on my blogs. Total views exceed 3 million, which surprised me. There are several thousand views every day, with some days spiking quite a bit more than that.

This blog, Book of Mormon Central America, initially focused on the setting of the Book of Mormon. When I started it, the organization Book of Mormon Central was promoting the Mesoamerican/Two-Cumorahs (M2C) theory exclusively (and adamantly). 

I've always said that around 80% of what Book of Mormon Central did was awesome. The other roughly 20%, not so much. 

What I considered poor content consisted mainly of their focus on M2C and SITH (the stone-in-the-hat) theory of translation. 

I'm fine with people believing whatever they want. In the pursuit of clarity, charity and understanding, we can all respect Latter-day Saints who still believe (and advocate) M2C and SITH.

But clarity, charity and understanding should prompt all Latter-day Saints--and especially scholars--to recognize multiple working hypotheses in a spirit of openness, transparency, and respect. From its founding, Book of Mormon Central as an organization refused to do that.

We'll see what the future brings, but I titled this post "Mission Accomplished" partly because by now, Latter-day Saints around the world know there is an alternative to M2C and SITH. I've heard from Latter-day Saints on every inhabited continent, and they're all enthusiastic about being able to make informed decisions without having to defer to scholars.

Latter-day Saints everywhere love to learn from the scriptures, the prophets, and authentic Church history documents.

This blog has been only a small part of educating the Latter-day Saints so they can make informed decisions. There are lots of podcasts, books, and other content that provide the information. 

Probably most important, the Joseph Smith Papers are making authentic historical documents available (at least to English speakers). 

Lately I've noticed much improvement in the content from Scripture Central, which replaced Book of Mormon Central. There seems to be more emphasis of transparency and less dogmatism, which is awesome.

Congrats to Scripture Central!

https://scripturecentral.org/

(We can't say the same for the Interpreter, but that's another story.)

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I've posted a few things recently on other blogs:

https://www.ldshistoricalnarratives.com/2025/04/reviewing-rough-stone-rolling.html

https://nomorecontention.blogspot.com/2025/04/latter-day-saints-love-for-each-other.html

https://dailyjonathanedwards.blogspot.com/2025/04/the-topstone.html

And I've added more annotations, such as Mosiah 3 and D&C 28, here:

https://www.mobom.org/jonathan-edwards


 

Friday, April 4, 2025

Gen Conf, SITH, Interpreter, etc.

I'm hearing General Conference will be exceptional, so be sure to watch/listen.

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On all of these blogs, we offer suggestions for improvement in the pursuit of clarity, charity and understanding. We charitably assume everyone is acting in good faith with the hope of bringing people to Christ, which is the only reason why we write these blogs.

We discuss these issues to bring clarity and understanding, always in an effort to help people make informed decisions, acknowledging our bias in favor of believing what Joseph and Oliver taught about the origin and setting of the Book of Mormon.

Regarding SITH, there are some new posts:

https://funwithsith.blogspot.com/2025/04/graphic-on-translation.html

https://interpreterpeerreviews.blogspot.com/2025/04/the-interpreter-doesnt-want-you-to-read.html

The latter one includes an in-depth review of Royal Skousen's part Seven, which we discussed on this blog a while back.

https://www.bookofmormoncentralamerica.com/2024/11/thank-you-royal-skousen.html

https://www.bookofmormoncentralamerica.com/2024/12/review-of-royal-skousens-methodology.html

Along those lines, we posted another comment here:

https://www.ldshistoricalnarratives.com/2025/03/royal-skousens-excerpt-technique.html

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We also applaud the recent work at Scripture Central to improve its content. For example, they deleted the old Spanish language site that included detailed maps of Cumorah in Mexico.

Book of Mormon Central's M2C map in Spanish

Good work!



Thursday, April 3, 2025

Rational Restoration summary


We're releasing the Second Edition of The Rational Restoration soon. 

The Second Edition incorporates lots of feedback and contains new sections drawn from posts on https://www.ldshistoricalnarratives.com/ and other blogs.

Here is the summary at the end of Chapter 10: Reframing Scripture:

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Summary

When we reframe the Book of Mormon as an inspired translation of an ancient record that contained “a history of the aborigines of this country” that was “written and deposited not far from” Joseph’s home near Palmyra, New York, we have a rational explanation for all the events and teaching in Church history related to the origin and setting of the Book of Mormon.

When we reframe the translation as Joseph described it—that he first translated individual characters and then the engravings on the plates by means of the Urim and Thummim that came with the plates—we can see that the text he dictated was “after the manner of his language.” (D&C 1:24) We then have a rational explanation for the so-called “errors” such as anachronisms and quotations from the King James translation, which we would expect if Joseph translated it. We also understand why the 1840 edition claims it was “Carefully revised by the translator.”

These rational explanations provide a sharp contrast to the SITH and M2C theories that require us to ignore or reject what Joseph and his contemporaries and successors taught about the translation with the Nephite interpreters known as the Urim and Thummim. We don’t have to ignore or reject what they taught about Cumorah/Ramah in western New York.

We can readily identify extrinsic evidence that corroborates both the origin (translation) and setting (geography) of the Book of Mormon.

The rational explanations of the rational restoration lower barriers to acceptance of the Book of Mormon as another Testament of Jesus Christ.


Wednesday, April 2, 2025

The red morocco trunk and SITH in Harmony, PA

In the pursuit of clarity, charity and understanding, it's useful to discuss Church history sites.

If you've visited the Priesthood Restoration site in what was Harmony, Pennsylvania, in 1827-1830, you've visited the small house where Joseph and Emma lived when Joseph translated the abridged plates.

(click to enlarge)

In that house there is a "red morocco trunk" on the bureau.

(click to enlarge)

Lucy mentioned the trunk when she related her experience when she came to visit Joseph in Harmony in the fall of 1828. 

when I entered his house the first thing that attracted [p. 135] my attention was a red morocco trunk, that set on Emma’s bureau; which trunk Joseph shortly informed me, contained the Urim and Thummim and the plates. 

In the evening he gave us the following relation of what had transpired since our separation… [quoting Joseph, p. 138] “on the 22d of September, I had the joy and satisfaction of again receiving the Urim and Thummim; and have commenced translating again, and Emma writes for me; but the angel said that the Lord would send me a scribe, and <​I​> trust his promise will be verified. He also seemed pleased with me, when he gave me back the Urim and Thummim; and he told me that the Lord loved me, for my faithfulness and humility.

 https://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/lucy-mack-smith-history-1845/142

Despite what Royal Skousen, Scripture Central, and other SITH scholars claim, Lucy's history tells us that Joseph had the Urim and Thummim when he was translating the abridged plates in Harmony. 

Of course, that's what Joseph and Oliver always said.

Here's the fun part.

In this view, you can see the red trunk on the right with the translating table in the left center.

(click to enlarge)

Below you can see the translating table, complete with the plates covered with a cloth and the white top hat visible.

(click to enlarge)

Recall that Lucy explained Joseph kept the Urim and Thummim and the plates in the red trunk. Nothing in the display mentions the Urim and Thummim, and the missionaries there don't tell people about it (at least they didn't when we visited).

Instead, they set up this display to indicate that Joseph use the stone-in-the-hat to "translate" the plates, which were supposedly under a cover the entire time.

I removed the cover to show the plates and took this photo:

(click to enlarge)

The next time you visit the Priesthood Restoration site, ask about the Urim and Thummim that Joseph kept in the red morocco trunk.

Now you have a link to an original source.


Friday, March 28, 2025

Myanmar earthquake

The earthquake today in Myanmar reminded me of our visit there in January 2020 where we saw some of the destruction caused by an earthquake in 2016, particularly to the temples in Bagan. We spent some time with a wonderful senior couple in Yangon who were doing greatly appreciated humanitarian work there.

Hopefully this earthquake has not destroyed more of the temples in Bagan.

archway in Bagan

earthquake damage from 2016

Bagan

temples in Bagan

Cool guys in Yangon

Yangon from our hotel

Shwedgaon Pagoda in Yangon


Wednesday, March 26, 2025