End of M2C: Brant's series concludes

I posted a peer review of Brant's part 13 here:

https://interpreterpeerreviews.blogspot.com/2025/07/brants-part-13.html

I keep the peer reviews on that blog for easier reference.

_____

In a related post, I discussed the treatment of Cumorah in some recent curriculum, here:

https://www.ldshistoricalnarratives.com/2025/06/improving-church-websites-cumorah.html

_____

Here's the intro to my peer review:

Brant Gardner finished his series of blog posts comparing M2C with the Heartland. Brant is a fine scholar, a great guy, and a faithful Latter-day Saint. 

The series is a good candidate for a FAITH model analysis if/when I get the time. Hopefully someone else will take the opportunity to separate the facts we all know from the various assumptions, inferences and theories that lead to the multiple working hypotheses found throughout the community of Latter-day Saints.

So in that sense, kudos to Brant.

But hopefully in the future he will consider employing the FAITH model.

_____

Beyond Parody-SITH in seminary

[Note: This is an older post that I forgot to publish, but it's still useful in the pursuit of clarity, charity and understanding.]

Recently I was conversing with a seminary teacher about how to teach the translation of the Book of Mormon. I explained that I stick with the scriptures, authentic historical sources, and the teachings of the prophets. He agreed. Then he said,

"But I have to teach what's in the manual," he said.

He had a good point. So I looked at the manual. 

As expected, the manual follows the SITH (stone-in-the-hat) teachings of the authors of the Gospel Topics Essay on Book of Mormon Translation. This means the manual does not quote what Joseph and Oliver said about the translation, apart from the ubiquitous short excerpt (the "gift and power of God") which, removed from its context, is misleading. 

The section of the Seminary manual to which he referred is here:

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/doctrine-and-covenants-seminary-teacher-manual-2025/062-the-translation-of-the-book-of-mormon?lang=eng

The manual depicts SITH.

SITH in the seminary manual

Then it says this:

This lesson is intended to help students strengthen their testimony that God provided means and power for Joseph Smith to translate the Book of Mormon for us.

But instead of informing students about what Joseph and Oliver said about the translation, the manual teaches what others claimed years later. 

Basically, the manual teaches what Mormonism Unvailed claimed in 1834; i.e., that Joseph didn't use the plates or the Urim and Thummim, as he and Oliver claimed, but instead read words off a stone he found in a well.

Maybe that "inoculates" students against claims from the critics, but another idea might be to teach students what Joseph and Oliver taught. After all, they faced the SITH narrative too, which is why they repeatedly, and in print, refuted SITH by affirming that Joseph used the Urim and Thummim that came with the plates.

My suggestions for improvement to the manual are here:

https://www.ldshistoricalnarratives.com/2025/02/2025-improvements-seminary-manual.html

These are simple fixes to the problem. 

_____

Let's look at why I say SITH is beyond parody. 

According to the seminary manual:

1. We're supposed to believe that God placed a special stone deep in the earth for Joseph to find while digging a well.

2. We're supposed to believe that Joseph used this stone instead of the Nephite interpreters (the Urim and Thummim) which the Lord

(i) created specifically for the purpose of translating sacred records, 

(ii) directed Moroni to include in the stone box with the plates, and 

(iii) said Joseph's gift to translate was based upon.

3. We're supposed to believe that Joseph did not even use the plates or the Urim and Thummim after all.

4. We're supposed to believe that the stone-in-the-hat (SITH) worked just as well as (and was more "convenient than") the Urim and Thummim.

5. We're supposed to believe Royal Skousen's claim that Joseph and Oliver deliberately misled everyone about the translation because they repeatedly and formally claimed that Joseph translated the plates by means of the Urim and Thummim that came with the plates.

Maybe students are fine with all of this. 

But anyone who knows what Joseph and Oliver said can see the inconsistency of teaching people to believe what Joseph and Oliver taught without teaching what Joseph and Oliver taught.

_____

There are four basic ways to address the historical record regarding the translation of the Book of Mormon.

1. Conclude that Joseph Smith, Oliver Cowdery, Samuel Smith and John Whitmer told the truth about the translation. This is the Urim and Thummim narrative of which the earliest known explanation was published in 1832 in Boston describing what Orson Hyde and Samuel Smith were teaching. https://www.mobom.org/urim-and-thummim-in-1832

This means that the SITH witnesses either (i) observed something else, such as a demonstration, and assumed they were witnessing the actual translation, or (ii) adopted SITH as an apologetic explanation to refute the Spalding theory. 

2. Conclude, as Royal Skousen and other LDS and non-LDS scholars have, that Joseph and Oliver deliberately misled everyone about the translation because Joseph didn't really use the Urim and Thummim or even refer to the plates, and he was embarrassed about the seer stone. This is the SITH narrative promoted by Mormonism Unvailed in 1834. For a discussion of the "embarrassed" narrative, see https://www.ldshistoricalnarratives.com/2024/09/the-embarrassed-narrative-and-sith.html

3. Conclude that Joseph used both the U&T and SITH by disregarding what everyone involved with the translation actually said (they all distinguished between the two--even Mormonism Unvailed did). Some scholars even claim that when Joseph and Oliver referred to the Urim and Thummim, they meant both the Nephite interpreters and the seer stone. This despite Joseph specifically explaining that he used the Urim and Thummim that came with the plates. See references here: https://www.mobom.org/church-history-issues

4. Conclude that we just don't know how it was done, that Joseph and Oliver were vague, that their successors in Church leadership were mistaken, and it doesn't matter because the words in the text by themselves testify of the divine authenticity of the Book of Mormon.

For Latter-day Saints and their friends to make informed decisions, they should at least know what Joseph and Oliver taught. Then they can choose among these alternative interpretations, pursuant to the FAITH model, which differentiates among

Facts

Assumptions

Inferences

Theories

Hypotheses

 

"I have obtained a promise"

We are happy for M2Cers to believe whatever they want to believe, but we also pursue clarity, charity and understanding.

It is easy to corroborate the teachings of the prophets about Cumorah with extrinsic evidence--if you want to.

Clarity in this case involves two voyages to the New World and the implications for what Lehi taught about the New World that the Lord led him to.

8 And behold, it is wisdom that this land should be kept as yet from the knowledge of other nations; for behold, many nations would overrun the land, that there would be no place for an inheritance.

9 Wherefore, I, Lehi, have obtained a promise, that inasmuch as those whom the Lord God shall bring out of the land of Jerusalem shall keep his commandments, they shall prosper upon the face of this land; and they shall be kept from all other nations, that they may possess this land unto themselves. 

(2 Nephi 1:8–9)

_____

A basic premise of M2C is that Lehi landed on the west coast of Mesoamerica in the midst of an extensive Mayan civilization. Some M2Cers also believe the Mulekites landed in Mesoamericn in the midst of an Olmec (Jaredite) civilization.

These theoretical voyages were shown on the map that RLDS scholar L.E. Hills proposed over 100 years ago. 

1917 map published by RLDS scholar L.E. Hills

To make his theory work, Hills put Cumorah in southern Mexico. He specifically rejected what Oliver Cowdery, Joseph Smith, David Whitmer, Brigham Young and everyone else said about Cumorah in New York.

"Cumorah" in Mexico, according to L.E. Hills

LDS leaders specifically rejected what Hills taught and reaffirmed the New York Cumorah, but gradually LDS scholars adopted the Hills theory instead. 

John Sorenson, Jack Welch, Kirk Magleby, Brant Gardner, and all their followers preferred Hills' theory about Cumorah over the teachings of the prophets.

BYU Studies map of Cumorah, based on L.E. Hills, as
adapted by Sorenson/Welch.

Next, Tyler Griffin created a fictional map to represent the Hills/Sorenson/Welch theory for new generations. (Somehow he and his followers think it's a good idea to teach the Book of Mormon using a fictional map more akin to Lord of the Rings than to any real-world setting.)  

Obviously, placing the Nephites and Mulekites in the midst of these Mesoamerican civilizations contradicts Lehi's declarations in verse 8-9. Mesoamerica was the opposite of what Lehi described. Again,

8 And behold, it is wisdom that this land should be kept as yet from the knowledge of other nations; for behold, many nations would overrun the land, that there would be no place for an inheritance.

9 Wherefore, I, Lehi, have obtained a promise, that inasmuch as those whom the Lord God shall bring out of the land of Jerusalem shall keep his commandments, they shall prosper upon the face of this land; and they shall be kept from all other nations, that they may possess this land unto themselves. 

(2 Nephi 1:8–9)

We can all see that the Mayans (and Olmecs) were well established nations. Naturally, the M2Cers have a variety of ways to rationalize the incongruity, but the plain language is there for everyone to read.

An alternative to M2C is the idea that Lehi followed ocean and wind currents, crossed the Atlantic, and actually landed in an area that was occupied only by unorganized hunter/gatherers in what is now the southeastern United States, circa 600 BC. 

Book of Mormon voyages and ocean currents

Then, after King Mosiah led the Nephites to Bountiful, the division of the Lamanites and Nephites looked something such as this, which explains why Cumorah is in New York.

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But there's more to it than that.

_____

The Lord explained to Nephi that if his brothers rebelled against God, they would become a "scourge" to Nephi's descendants.

22 And inasmuch as thou shalt keep my commandments, thou shalt be made a ruler and a teacher over thy brethren.

23 For behold, in that day that they shall rebel against me, I will curse them even with a sore curse, and they shall have no power over thy seed except they shall rebel against me also.

24 And if it so be that they rebel against me, they shall be a scourge unto thy seed, to stir them up in the ways of remembrance.

(1 Nephi 2:22–24)

25 And the Lord God said unto me: They shall be a scourge unto thy seed, to stir them up in remembrance of me; and inasmuch as they will not remember me, and hearken unto my words, they shall scourge them even unto destruction.

(2 Nephi 5:24–25)

According to the text, it was the Lamanites, not the Mayan nations of kings and warriors, who were a scourge to the Nephites.

To repeat: It is easy to corroborate the teachings of the prophets about Cumorah with extrinsic evidence--if you want to.

"ceremony" in Mosiah and Scripture Central

In the ongoing pursuit of clarity, charity and understanding, I posted a peer review of an article on Scripture Central about the term "ceremony" in Mosiah 19:24. 

https://scripturecentralpeerreviews.blogspot.com/2025/07/ceremony-in-mosiah-1924.html

Basically, the term makes perfect sense once we see how Jonathan Edwards used the term.

But because the scholars haven't looked at Edwards, we have Royal Skousen speculating that the term is a "scribal error." We have various Book of Mormon "experts" offering a variety of speculative theories based on assumptions and inferences that lead to a confusing spectrum of apologetic theories.

Of course, given the scholars involved, none of them proposed that Joseph translated the plates correctly using his own language...

Except me.

:)

But hopefully my peer review will lead to improvement in this area going forward.

M2C in the Interpreter-again, as usual

I'm always curious if Interpreter readers think for themselves, do their own research, or merely accept what the Interpreter publishes.  

Because I encourage people to make informed decisions for themselves, and to avoid relying on self-appointed "experts" who reject what Joseph and Oliver taught, I did another peer review of an Interpreter article.

This one is the introduction to a new series of article in the Interpreter, which are resurrecting the 2005 Library of Congress symposium on "the Worlds of Joseph Smith."

We've discussed that several times on this blog. 

This series consists of chapters from a book. 

My peer review of the introduction is here:

https://interpreterpeerreviews.blogspot.com/2025/07/review-anachronisms-accidental-evidence.html

As is common with Interpreter articles, this one is well-intentioned. It no doubt reflects the views of many Latter-day Saints who still believe M2C.

But it also is another example of the difference between apologetics and scholarship, in the sense that it contains the expected omission of relevant material that contradicts the M2C narrative.

See for yourself.

:)

What constitutes an "expert"

In his analysis of a recent Supreme Court case, Jonathan Turley discussed Justice Thomas' concurring opinion. His observation reminds us of the self-appointed "experts" on the Book of Mormon who also "insulate" their M2C opinions as "self-evidently true."

The sentence bolded below applies to the M2Cers who continue to try to persuade Latter-day Saints to disbelieve the teachings of the prophets about the Hill Cumorah in New York.

In his concurrence in United States v. Skrmetti, a case upholding Tennessee’s ban on adolescent transgender treatments, Thomas called for his colleagues to stand against an “expert class” that has dictated both policy and legal conclusions in the United States.

The reference to “experts” is often used to insulate an opinion as self-evidently true on a given question when they speak as a group. It distinguishes the informed from the casual; the certifiably authoritative from the merely interested. Yet, what constitutes an “expert” can be little more than an advanced degree, and the “overwhelming opinion of experts” can be little more than groupthink.

https://jonathanturley.org/2025/06/26/the-icarian-gene-the-rise-and-fall-of-the-expert-class/

Turley went on to briefly review the reasons why the public generally has lost trust in these "experts." I can relate to that.

For decades, I trusted the LDS "experts" at BYU, such as John Sorenson and Jack Welch, regarding the origin and setting of the Book of Mormon. Life was busy, and we all defer to experts in various aspects of our lives.

But then I noticed some inconsistencies and delved into the topic. I discovered the fundamental fallacy of M2C and the rhetorical devices used by the M2C scholars to circumvent and repudiate the teachings of the prophets.  

In my experience, Latter-day Saints who take the responsibility for making their own informed decisions find, like I have, that the "experts" have not been open, transparent, and candid about these topics. Now that the Internet has made authentic Church history sources readily available, the premise of M2C is less credible than ever.

Here's how Turley explained it:

Over the years, the mystique took on a more menacing aspect for many in the country as they watched academic and scientific groups become more advocates than experts. ...

The result has been a dramatic change in trust for higher education and, by extension, the supremacy of the expert class. According to Gallup, only a third of Americans today have great confidence in higher education and roughly the same number have little or no confidence. That is a drop of over twenty percent in the last ten years.

Turley concluded with an important caveat that also applies in the LDS context. If/when such groups as the Interpreter, FAIRLDS, and Scripture Central decide to value open inquiry and a diversity of faithful viewpoints, Latter-day Saints generally will have more confidence in their work.

None of this means that courts or the public should disregard science or experts. Indeed, many experts still follow core principles of unbiased inquiry and discourse. However, good science requires open inquiry and a diversity of viewpoints. Citizens are rejecting science by plebiscite, the self-authenticating petitions where academics purported to speak for an expert class. 

End of M2C: Brant's series

In the ongoing pursuit of clarity, charity and understanding, let's provide some clarity to Brant Gardner's series comparing Heartland to M2C (which the M2C-obsessed Meridian Magazine faithfully republishes).

Brant, who is an awesome guy, careful scholar, faithful Latter-day Saint, etc., has written extensively about the Book of Mormon to promote his M2C (Mesoamerican/Two-Cumorahs) theory. 

But everything he has written reminds me of a talk by then-President Uchtdorf.

The difference between Heartland and M2C "comes down to an error of only a few degrees."

Suppose you were to take off from an airport at the equator, intending to circumnavigate the globe, but your course was off by just one degree. By the time you returned to the same longitude, how far off course would you be? A few miles? A hundred miles? The answer might surprise you. An error of only one degree would put you almost 500 miles (800 km) off course, or one hour of flight for a jet....

The longer we delay corrective action, the larger the needed changes become, and the longer it takes to get back on the correct course—even to the point where a disaster might be looming.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2008/04/a-matter-of-a-few-degrees?lang=eng

The "few degrees" in this case consist of whether or not we believe what the prophets have taught about Cumorah.

If we align with the prophets, the course is clear: Cumorah/Ramah is in New York.

If we're off by even one degree because we reject what the prophets have taught, we end up with theories such as M2C (the Mesoamerican/Two-Cumorahs theory), the Baja theory, the Peru theory, the Malaysia theory, or any number of other theories, including the "pious fiction" theory.

Every proponent can rationalize his/her theory by interpreting the text to fit while also citing extrinsic scientific evidence. People debate the relative credibility of their various interpretations and evidence, leading to "a strife of words and a contest about opinions." (Joseph Smith—History 1:6)

A solution would be pursuing clarity, charity and understanding instead of trying to persuade. People can believe whatever they want, and that's fine.

People want to make informed decisions, and we should be happy that Brant has made an effort in that direction. 

However, as always, clarity is the sticking point.

So let's start with clarity about 2 points.

_____

Point 1 

The location of Cumorah does not determine any other Book of Mormon sites. People who accept the teachings of the prophets can have a wide range of beliefs about the scope of the Book of Mormon setting, and that's all fine. The Gospel Topics entry on Book of Mormon geography recognizes this diversity. 

Note that the entry does not even mention Cumorah, which makes sense because Cumorah, as Oliver said, is a fact and well attested. The entry does not repudiate any teachings of the prophets. 

_____

Point 2

We can all see that Brant and his fellow M2Cers base their entire theory on one basic premise:

Oliver Cowdery misled everyone when he declared it was a fact that the final battles of the Nephites and Jaredites took place in the mile-wide valley west of the hill Cumorah/Ramah in New York where Joseph found the plates.

http://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/history-1834-1836/90

Because of this premise that leads them off by one degree, M2Cers even claim that Joseph Smith adopted this "false" Cumorah. (D&C 128:20)

M2Cers claim that Lucy Mack Smith falsely reported that it was Moroni who identified the hill as Cumorah when he first visited Joseph Smith, and that she falsely reported that Joseph referred to the hill as Cumorah even before he got the plates.

M2Cers claim that David Whitmer falsely reported that the messenger who had the abridged plates said he was going to Cumorah. 

M2Cers claim that Parley P. Pratt falsely reported that during the 1830 mission to the Lamanites, Oliver explained that it was Moroni who called the hill Cumorah.

M2Cers claim that all the prophets who have reiterated the New York Cumorah/Ramah, including members of the First Presidency speaking in General Conference, have been merely expressing their own opinions and that those opinions were wrong such that they were misleading the Latter-day Saints.

That President Uchtdorf used a volcano in his example is fitting because M2Cers, having veered off course by one degree, lead their followers to believe that the Book of Mormon describes the volcanoes in Mesoamerica.

That's not an unreasonable interpretation.

But it's far from the only reasonable interpretation.

Readers naturally wonder why a civilization living for a thousand years in a limited area of Mesoamerica described volcanoes only once, and didn't even use a term that Joseph would have translated as "volcano." 

Obviously there is much more we could say (and have said), but it is useful to see how one simple degree of variance from the teachings of the prophets can lead to a voluminous body of rationalization, such as Brant has been publishing.

And it's all good. People can believe whatever they want.

But every Latter-day Saint deserves to know exactly what the premise of M2C is and how every theory can be rationalized through interpretation of the text and use of extrinsic evidence.

We all just need to ask, are we on the course Oliver and Joseph and their successors mapped out for us, or have we veered off by one or more degrees?